Re: Here we go again...
This WebDNA talk-list message is from 2006
It keeps the original formatting.
numero = 66691
interpreted = N
texte = On Apr 3, 2006, at 2:53 PM, Bess Ho wrote: > Can you use WebDNA database outside WebDNA folder? That doesn't have anything to do with its being relational or not. Probably wouldn't want a web application available outside the scope of the web server for security reasons. > Are you required to use WebDNA to interect with WebDNA database? For reading, no. If you want to affect the data, you either have to use WebDNA, or be able to toggle the server or WebDNA service(s) to make sure dbs are flushed. > How do you see the database relationship? Just like you see gravity. Graphically modeling relational data is sort of like heroine to some. Personally, I'd probably take up hand gliding. > > Bess > -----Original Message----- > From: WebDNA Talk [mailto:WebDNA-Talk@talk.smithmicro.com]On Behalf Of > Pat McCormick > Sent: Saturday, April 01, 2006 6:43 AM > To: WebDNA Talk > Subject: Re: Here we go again... > > > Actually WebDNA doesn't use a flat file. That is the case for the > older Typhoon version, but WebDNA, simply because it can have > multiple databases open, is no longer a flat file system. > > The difference is that WebDNA doesn't formalize the structure of a db > in any way. You are responsible for define a sku or key field and > there are some nice tools to assist the process, like [cart]. > Comparing that with SQL or Access, those products get more antsy > about key fields, and field formats in general. They also enforce the > idea of a database consisting of a collection of tables, which is > also confusing nonsense. > > The purpose for products like Oracle, SQL and other "databases" is to > encrypt your text so that you need to buy their products to see your > text. Web-DNA is the un-database database. Create your own > relationships. All key fields are optional. Structure your project > any way you want, even using virtual databases ([table]), and to make > it even better, keep all the data in plain text so you can x-ray the > files at any time using any text tool. Ya gotta love that! > > > > > > > On Mar 31, 2006, at 2:12 PM, Bess Ho wrote: > >> WebDNA is using flat file for storing data. It is not a >> relationship database like MySQL. Also once your flat file grow >> beyond roughly 2 GB (check with Network Admin to verify the size), >> you can't run data very well. The go-around solution is to break >> down WebDNA database into smaller chunks for faster performance. >> You really need Relationship Database for scaleable application. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: WebDNA Talk [mailto:WebDNA-Talk@talk.smithmicro.com]On >> Behalf Of >> Kenneth Grome >> Sent: Friday, March 31, 2006 4:55 AM >> To: WebDNA Talk >> Subject: Re: Here we go again... >> >> >> On Fri, 31 Mar 2006 07:05:55 -0500, Terry Wilson wrote: >>> ... you never know when you'll be required to start doing >>> something a >>> certain way; or at some point, an old solution just isn't good >>> enough >>> or fast enough any longer ... >> >> >> Example: >> >> A client of mine preferred webdna but his searches were too slow, >> so he hired me to debug and fix them. His code was fine but the >> database files were not configured to optimize webdna's >> performance, so I could only recommend two options: (1) >> reconfigure the databases (not a good solution because updated data >> files came from another source frequently) ... or (2) switch to >> MySQL and give that a try ... >> >> I really didn't know if MySQL could handle the task any faster than >> webdna and I told him this, but he went for it anyways. He said >> webdna hosting cost too much anyways, and since he wasn't committed >> to using it on his server anyways (although he enjoyed personally >> mocking up web sites because it's east for a non-programmer to use) >> he decided to go with PHP and MySQL. >> >> The moment we switched his search times dropped from about 10 >> seconds to less than two seconds. I think the reason is two-fold: >> (1) he had database files that were too large for webdna to RAM- >> cache efficiently, and (2) we were doing nested searches, and >> webdna is pretty slow sometimes when using nested searches, >> especially with large db files. >> >> The bottom line is that he "outgrew" webdna for use on his server, >> and now he's happy again with a faster free solution. I think this >> type of situation is going to become more and more common as webdna >> continues to be less and less aggressively developed, supported and >> marketed. >> >> Sincerely, >> Kenneth Grome >> >> owner@kengrome.com >> kengrome@gmail.com >> www.kengrome.com >> >> >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------- >> This message is sent to you because you are subscribed to >> the mailing list
. >> To unsubscribe, E-mail to: >> To switch to the DIGEST mode, E-mail to > digest@talk.smithmicro.com> >> Web Archive of this list is at: http://webdna.smithmicro.com/ >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------- >> This message is sent to you because you are subscribed to >> the mailing list . >> To unsubscribe, E-mail to: >> To switch to the DIGEST mode, E-mail to > digest@talk.smithmicro.com> >> Web Archive of this list is at: http://webdna.smithmicro.com/ >> > > > ------------------------------------------------------------- > This message is sent to you because you are subscribed to > the mailing list . > To unsubscribe, E-mail to: > To switch to the DIGEST mode, E-mail to digest@talk.smithmicro.com> > Web Archive of this list is at: http://webdna.smithmicro.com/ > > ------------------------------------------------------------- > This message is sent to you because you are subscribed to > the mailing list . > To unsubscribe, E-mail to: > To switch to the DIGEST mode, E-mail to digest@talk.smithmicro.com> > Web Archive of this list is at: http://webdna.smithmicro.com/ > ------------------------------------------------------------- This message is sent to you because you are subscribed to the mailing list . To unsubscribe, E-mail to: To switch to the DIGEST mode, E-mail to Web Archive of this list is at: http://webdna.smithmicro.com/
Associated Messages, from the most recent to the oldest:
On Apr 3, 2006, at 2:53 PM, Bess Ho wrote: > Can you use WebDNA database outside WebDNA folder? That doesn't have anything to do with its being relational or not. Probably wouldn't want a web application available outside the scope of the web server for security reasons. > Are you required to use WebDNA to interect with WebDNA database? For reading, no. If you want to affect the data, you either have to use WebDNA, or be able to toggle the server or WebDNA service(s) to make sure dbs are flushed. > How do you see the database relationship? Just like you see gravity. Graphically modeling relational data is sort of like heroine to some. Personally, I'd probably take up hand gliding. > > Bess > -----Original Message----- > From: WebDNA Talk [mailto:WebDNA-Talk@talk.smithmicro.com]On Behalf Of > Pat McCormick > Sent: Saturday, April 01, 2006 6:43 AM > To: WebDNA Talk > Subject: Re: Here we go again... > > > Actually WebDNA doesn't use a flat file. That is the case for the > older Typhoon version, but WebDNA, simply because it can have > multiple databases open, is no longer a flat file system. > > The difference is that WebDNA doesn't formalize the structure of a db > in any way. You are responsible for define a sku or key field and > there are some nice tools to assist the process, like [cart]. > Comparing that with SQL or Access, those products get more antsy > about key fields, and field formats in general. They also enforce the > idea of a database consisting of a collection of tables, which is > also confusing nonsense. > > The purpose for products like Oracle, SQL and other "databases" is to > encrypt your text so that you need to buy their products to see your > text. Web-DNA is the un-database database. Create your own > relationships. All key fields are optional. Structure your project > any way you want, even using virtual databases ([table]), and to make > it even better, keep all the data in plain text so you can x-ray the > files at any time using any text tool. Ya gotta love that! > > > > > > > On Mar 31, 2006, at 2:12 PM, Bess Ho wrote: > >> WebDNA is using flat file for storing data. It is not a >> relationship database like MySQL. Also once your flat file grow >> beyond roughly 2 GB (check with Network Admin to verify the size), >> you can't run data very well. The go-around solution is to break >> down WebDNA database into smaller chunks for faster performance. >> You really need Relationship Database for scaleable application. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: WebDNA Talk [mailto:WebDNA-Talk@talk.smithmicro.com]On >> Behalf Of >> Kenneth Grome >> Sent: Friday, March 31, 2006 4:55 AM >> To: WebDNA Talk >> Subject: Re: Here we go again... >> >> >> On Fri, 31 Mar 2006 07:05:55 -0500, Terry Wilson wrote: >>> ... you never know when you'll be required to start doing >>> something a >>> certain way; or at some point, an old solution just isn't good >>> enough >>> or fast enough any longer ... >> >> >> Example: >> >> A client of mine preferred webdna but his searches were too slow, >> so he hired me to debug and fix them. His code was fine but the >> database files were not configured to optimize webdna's >> performance, so I could only recommend two options: (1) >> reconfigure the databases (not a good solution because updated data >> files came from another source frequently) ... or (2) switch to >> MySQL and give that a try ... >> >> I really didn't know if MySQL could handle the task any faster than >> webdna and I told him this, but he went for it anyways. He said >> webdna hosting cost too much anyways, and since he wasn't committed >> to using it on his server anyways (although he enjoyed personally >> mocking up web sites because it's east for a non-programmer to use) >> he decided to go with PHP and MySQL. >> >> The moment we switched his search times dropped from about 10 >> seconds to less than two seconds. I think the reason is two-fold: >> (1) he had database files that were too large for webdna to RAM- >> cache efficiently, and (2) we were doing nested searches, and >> webdna is pretty slow sometimes when using nested searches, >> especially with large db files. >> >> The bottom line is that he "outgrew" webdna for use on his server, >> and now he's happy again with a faster free solution. I think this >> type of situation is going to become more and more common as webdna >> continues to be less and less aggressively developed, supported and >> marketed. >> >> Sincerely, >> Kenneth Grome >> >> owner@kengrome.com >> kengrome@gmail.com >> www.kengrome.com >> >> >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------- >> This message is sent to you because you are subscribed to >> the mailing list . >> To unsubscribe, E-mail to: >> To switch to the DIGEST mode, E-mail to > digest@talk.smithmicro.com> >> Web Archive of this list is at: http://webdna.smithmicro.com/ >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------- >> This message is sent to you because you are subscribed to >> the mailing list . >> To unsubscribe, E-mail to: >> To switch to the DIGEST mode, E-mail to > digest@talk.smithmicro.com> >> Web Archive of this list is at: http://webdna.smithmicro.com/ >> > > > ------------------------------------------------------------- > This message is sent to you because you are subscribed to > the mailing list . > To unsubscribe, E-mail to: > To switch to the DIGEST mode, E-mail to digest@talk.smithmicro.com> > Web Archive of this list is at: http://webdna.smithmicro.com/ > > ------------------------------------------------------------- > This message is sent to you because you are subscribed to > the mailing list . > To unsubscribe, E-mail to: > To switch to the DIGEST mode, E-mail to digest@talk.smithmicro.com> > Web Archive of this list is at: http://webdna.smithmicro.com/ > ------------------------------------------------------------- This message is sent to you because you are subscribed to the mailing list . To unsubscribe, E-mail to: To switch to the DIGEST mode, E-mail to Web Archive of this list is at: http://webdna.smithmicro.com/
Pat McCormick
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